Do Celestials lose their individuality

Discussions of the book Judas of Kerioth
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Geoff
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Re: Do Celestials lose their individuality

Postby Geoff » Thu Mar 08, 2012 12:22 am

Hey there James,

You made some excellent points, and some that I will think about.

I particularly like this idea:
Polarity is not strictly necessary in the presence of a system of hierarchical Laws.
Worth thinking about that one.

love,
Geoff
Love commands the universe. Man only resorts to control when love is missing.

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Re: Do Celestials lose their individuality

Postby James B » Fri Mar 09, 2012 1:06 am

Hi Geoff and Doles! Long post here; sorry!

Doles, the issue between knowledge and faith is a sticky one, to say the least. What we're essentially given with Divine Love is a "short cut" in which whatever abilities and knowledge we need on our path is given to us.

Consider that our natural learning is like coding a computer program. The more we code, and the more we learn from others who code, the better we get. It takes time and effort and practice, but we also learn more and more. We can create enormously complex programs, but they're prone to have little mistakes in them, and we have to go back and correct those mistakes. All the way through, we're responsible for *every* line of code.

The Divine path is like having all of the programs you could have a use for written perfectly by the Father and downloaded into you, as well as a system upgrade (the New Birth). You are responsible for the speed at which this happens, as you increase your "bandwidth" (your faith) as you pray for Divine Love, which in turn speeds up the process. Since we're all relatively early in the process, our bandwidth is low, and the "packets" are prioritized into "system upgrade" and little bits of knowledge that the Father and our Thought Adjusters know we will need first. The more Love you have in you, the faster the upgrade and the more that you will find you understand about creation and the Father himself.

With this Love comes an absolute trust in God. Consider that by praying for Love, you are allowing the Creator of All (who by definition has overwhelming power relative to you) to "mess with you." You're giving Him permission to rearrange your *very soul* and make it into something that He sees as better and that you *hope* is better. My mother, for instance, understands this loss of control very keenly, and is afraid to try. I know this loss of control very keenly, I knew it right out of the gate when I first comprehended what the messages were talking about, but I felt a greater need to bridge the gap between me and God that overcame that fear. You might be worried at first, but it quickly becomes obvious how much the Father cares for you. Once that roadblock is surpassed, things move a lot faster.

This bleeds into what Geoff said about IQ and Atheism: With knowledge comes (the illusion of) control. We're taught to fight for control of our lives (and sometimes more) all our life, starting at least from the day we hit school. No well-educated adult takes with grace the idea that even as an "adult," we're children in the grand scheme of things; that "power" and "control" are concepts we should be leaving to spirits thousands of years our senior, who have actually earned those things, and be the joyful, carefree children we really are, soaking up experience like a sponge. Conversely, we can pray for Divine Love, and allow the Father to impart his greatest Gift, altering us and advancing us so that we are ready for real responsibility, stripped of all the negative connotations that words like "power" and "control" imply.

No academic would like hearing that just by meditating daily on the Father and his Love, I will be granted the insight and abilities that he would learn over decades here and in the Natural Spheres. It lays bare the illusion that this life is, and directly insults their decisions. I would know: I was one of them before I made the jump to the Divine Path. That was quite the experience.

Alright, enough out of me. That's probably more than a penny's worth of thoughts. :lol:

-James

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Re: Do Celestials lose their individuality

Postby Kris » Sun Mar 20, 2016 8:23 pm

Geoff wrote :

Very likely. The statistics are, the higher the IQ, the higher the probability that you will be an atheist. These things (the divine pathway) are not of the mind, they are of the soul. If you are a sixth sphereian, all mindal, I doubt you could have the perspective and faith that is required.


This remembers me words expressed here Words by spinoza to James Padgett. I just red them again this afternoon :

"It is the greatest faculty that man has as a creature of the Almighty, and without it, some of the wise of earth have said man would be no better than or different from the brute animal. But this is not quite true, for man is possessed with that which is really man himself that the brute animal does not have, and that is a soul made in the image of its Creator. It may be said that reason is merely an appendage of the soul; and I have justification in asserting that the soul in its progress can do without or cast aside this reason without doing harm to itself because, as I have learned in progressing in the spirit life, the soul may and does arrive at that degree of development where reason is not necessary or even used by it in its acquirement of truth.

I now believe, and without speculation, that reason is a gift to man to be useful to him only in his earth life and in a portion of this spirit life, until the soul comes into a knowledge of truth by the exercise of the mere desire to know. A knowledge of the whys and wherefores is not required, but it knows because it knows, just as in your earth life you have a knowledge of the sunlight even if you do not know the why and the wherefore that produce that light."


By the way in the message Do Celestians Spirits lose their individuality it is written :

"There is a wonderful union here in our Heavens. But how can I explain this to you? Imagine a city, where architects, urban planners, gardeners, in short, all the people responsible for the aspect, quality, atmosphere, etc., join their forces to launch some project, without considering their own profit, because they will anyway receive their fair recompense. They put up their hands to do the work, on an altruistic basis for the welfare of the entire society. It is a utopian idea you think, but just imagine it. Unselfish help, cooperation, understanding - it would be like a dream. In some way, in some way even more perfect, this exists in the sixth spiritual sphere. It is paradise, as mortals always imagined it. And all this exists in the Celestial Heavens, raised to a much higher degree. I cannot explain it to you better, but at least you have some inkling now of how it is in reality."

We are used to separate Human Love (or Natural Love) and Gods' Love (Divine Love). In fact, there is just one love and this is God's Love. Human Love is always, in some way, limited. However in reading the above text it is difficult to imagine than something more than just a "perfect world" can exist.Since many years I have, in my mind, this question "What is the difference between a Christian and an atheist if both are just expressing, in their way of live, Love ?". In fact it is no easy to understand, if not intectually, the difference between God's Love and Human's Love. Can an atheist, truly convice of the importance and value of love, can experience, however unconsciously, God's Love ?

All the best.

Kris

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Re: Do Celestials lose their individuality

Postby Kris » Mon Mar 21, 2016 10:36 am

Hi Geoff;

As you were mentioning Silvia Borwone's book : "Life on the other side", I just started to look a the Pdf version available on the web. Actually as I am reading this book it speaks a lot about reincarnation. Furthermore it seems the book is "just" about some experiences she had with her spiritual guide.

Is there really anything valuable to learn in this book ?

Kris

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Re: Do Celestials lose their individuality

Postby Geoff » Mon Mar 21, 2016 12:01 pm

Hi Kris,

Not much. She confirms that the Seventh Sphere exists, and that it is drastically different to the sixth, but she is of the opinion she is not interested in it.

There is some stuff about the hall of records I really liked, the fact that the records are multi-sensory which is exactly why so many people who access these believe it's their historic record because it feels so real.

But she also has pretty crazy ideas about what happens to "bad" people.

Hugs
Geoff
Love commands the universe. Man only resorts to control when love is missing.


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